|Home| Info| Community| Business| Beaches| What to do?| Rentals| News| Forum| Blogs| Finance| History| FAQ| Contact|
oh no!!!
-
Guest
oh no!!!
a letter in this weeks "news" tells us that a company called wholesalevillas
see their site www.wholesalevillas.com
who very happily announce that they plan to build a 1000 villas in the silves area...despite the destruction of the fires they will be building for three years and want to make it like villa vita in armacao de pera.
ie artificial with lurid green grass kept so by water pumping night and day so idiots r us can knock their liitle white balls into holes in the ground and if like villa vita you want to enjoy such a resort then be prepared for a very very expensive lifestyle
can no one ever fathom that there are now enough houses in portugal...most of them are empty most of the time.
how sad that portugal know not how to stop building
see their site www.wholesalevillas.com
who very happily announce that they plan to build a 1000 villas in the silves area...despite the destruction of the fires they will be building for three years and want to make it like villa vita in armacao de pera.
ie artificial with lurid green grass kept so by water pumping night and day so idiots r us can knock their liitle white balls into holes in the ground and if like villa vita you want to enjoy such a resort then be prepared for a very very expensive lifestyle
can no one ever fathom that there are now enough houses in portugal...most of them are empty most of the time.
how sad that portugal know not how to stop building
-
Ellie
Fires ? More building?
Guest--your topic leaves a very very big 
hanging over the fire devastation doesnt it and hence, now all the massive building plans 
May one dare use the word "deliberate land clearance"--money grabbing big business?
The thought of ever more "artificial landscapes" horrifies me. Your alluding to the "golf course scenery"--leads me to my first witnessing of Pestana golf -on my recent holiday. I actually went there to try to look up a very old friend who works there --but after walking round getting lost and feeling as though I wandered into some surreal nightmare --i gave up and was glad to high tail out
Surrounding this artificial monstrosity there were complete areas of wilderness broken down walls badly kept roads--but at least it was "real" and I know which I prefer--yet I know it wont be long before that too will be carved out for ever more luxury villas and --heaven forbid ---golf courses.
Guest--good topic--I hope you will endorse Mine and Sharons words about restoration of fine old Portuguese houses
hanging over the fire devastation doesnt it and hence, now all the massive building plans May one dare use the word "deliberate land clearance"--money grabbing big business?The thought of ever more "artificial landscapes" horrifies me. Your alluding to the "golf course scenery"--leads me to my first witnessing of Pestana golf -on my recent holiday. I actually went there to try to look up a very old friend who works there --but after walking round getting lost and feeling as though I wandered into some surreal nightmare --i gave up and was glad to high tail out
Surrounding this artificial monstrosity there were complete areas of wilderness broken down walls badly kept roads--but at least it was "real" and I know which I prefer--yet I know it wont be long before that too will be carved out for ever more luxury villas and --heaven forbid ---golf courses.
Guest--good topic--I hope you will endorse Mine and Sharons words about restoration of fine old Portuguese houses
-
Guest
well let me answer as i started this thread...having a property on a golfcourse..(and yes i have considered it) is madness..its the sort of place where the only thing you can do is to sit and drink gin and tonics in your designer golf shirt...can you imagine someone hanging a line of washing up...or getting your power tools out ....or repairing a car...i dont think so!!
an article in one spainsh golf magazine said that a golf course uses more water that a town of 23000 people....where or where does this water come from?
a friend who worked on the vilamoura golf course told me that there they had two or three bore holes pumping night and day ...there has to be a finite limit to these underground supplies...but in our perfect world or resorts such as iwe see planned, such considerations are fairly low on the agenda
an article in one spainsh golf magazine said that a golf course uses more water that a town of 23000 people....where or where does this water come from?
a friend who worked on the vilamoura golf course told me that there they had two or three bore holes pumping night and day ...there has to be a finite limit to these underground supplies...but in our perfect world or resorts such as iwe see planned, such considerations are fairly low on the agenda
the article said that water comsumption of 23000 eople was equal to that of a golf course..my father who was an architect use to base his calculations on 150 litres per person per day...
no the friend worked on the irrigation.
where else can water come from? well only from rainfall or underground
and underground supplies are a work of nature.
another friend who had lived in lagos for 25 years was told by one camara official that under lagos there was a huge lake which supplied them with water...guess what ..that lake is now gone
i am afraid that it is a simple fact that in such environments as in the algarve with temps of over 100 fht...only by pumping water through irrigation all the time can they be kept green,...this is why they are artificial.
i am waiting one day to hear of a golf course on the south pole..heated pipes..imported top soil...well why not..yes its daft...but surely no more daft than what we see locally
no the friend worked on the irrigation.
where else can water come from? well only from rainfall or underground
and underground supplies are a work of nature.
another friend who had lived in lagos for 25 years was told by one camara official that under lagos there was a huge lake which supplied them with water...guess what ..that lake is now gone
i am afraid that it is a simple fact that in such environments as in the algarve with temps of over 100 fht...only by pumping water through irrigation all the time can they be kept green,...this is why they are artificial.
i am waiting one day to hear of a golf course on the south pole..heated pipes..imported top soil...well why not..yes its daft...but surely no more daft than what we see locally
MArtin/Guest
the article said that water comsumption of 23000 eople was equal to that of a golf course..my father who was an architect use to base his calculations on 150 litres per person per day...
My calculations show that for a par-72 championship course in the Algarve, average water consumption of 2,800 cubic meters per day at the “height of the summer season” (i.e. July-August) using 419 hybrid bermudagrass for tees, fairways , roughs, with bentgrass greens, is a good figure. Your town’s consummation is 3.4m Liters, the golf course is 2.8m L, a little less. Of course in the fall, spring, winter months the consummation on the golf course never approaches the maximum figure shown.
no the friend worked on the irrigation.
Was he just repairing the irrigation system or monitoring the boreholes??
where else can water come from? well only from rainfall or underground
and underground supplies are a work of nature.
Well there is also desaltination plants for one. Where does the other agricultural crops get their water from; certainly not from rainfall or underground supplies?
another friend who had lived in lagos for 25 years was told by one camara official that under lagos there was a huge lake which supplied them with water...guess what ..that lake is now gone
I am not sure how long ago was that, but there’s no golf course in Lagos except for the new course outside of town, Boa Vista, that’s only been opened nearly one year. As a matter of interest how big was this underground lake in terms of capacity, and where was its reach (underground location, in the center of Lagos?)? Has anyone did a study to determine where this water went too?
i am afraid that it is a simple fact that in such environments as in the algarve with temps of over 100 fht...only by pumping water through irrigation all the time can they be kept green,...this is why they are artificial.
“all the time”, not quite the real story. Its not over 100 fht 365 days a year.
i am waiting one day to hear of a golf course on the south pole..heated pipes..imported top soil...well why not..yes its daft...but surely no more daft than what we see locally
I am sure there is no market down there to warrant that idea.
the article said that water comsumption of 23000 eople was equal to that of a golf course..my father who was an architect use to base his calculations on 150 litres per person per day...
My calculations show that for a par-72 championship course in the Algarve, average water consumption of 2,800 cubic meters per day at the “height of the summer season” (i.e. July-August) using 419 hybrid bermudagrass for tees, fairways , roughs, with bentgrass greens, is a good figure. Your town’s consummation is 3.4m Liters, the golf course is 2.8m L, a little less. Of course in the fall, spring, winter months the consummation on the golf course never approaches the maximum figure shown.
no the friend worked on the irrigation.
Was he just repairing the irrigation system or monitoring the boreholes??
where else can water come from? well only from rainfall or underground
and underground supplies are a work of nature.
Well there is also desaltination plants for one. Where does the other agricultural crops get their water from; certainly not from rainfall or underground supplies?
another friend who had lived in lagos for 25 years was told by one camara official that under lagos there was a huge lake which supplied them with water...guess what ..that lake is now gone
I am not sure how long ago was that, but there’s no golf course in Lagos except for the new course outside of town, Boa Vista, that’s only been opened nearly one year. As a matter of interest how big was this underground lake in terms of capacity, and where was its reach (underground location, in the center of Lagos?)? Has anyone did a study to determine where this water went too?
i am afraid that it is a simple fact that in such environments as in the algarve with temps of over 100 fht...only by pumping water through irrigation all the time can they be kept green,...this is why they are artificial.
“all the time”, not quite the real story. Its not over 100 fht 365 days a year.
i am waiting one day to hear of a golf course on the south pole..heated pipes..imported top soil...well why not..yes its daft...but surely no more daft than what we see locally
I am sure there is no market down there to warrant that idea.
-
Hi handicap
Interesting debate.
In many countries in Europe farmers are trying to convert their land to golf courses because they cannot make a living from their land by agricultural means.
In Portugal the land that is being converted has little other commercial benefit, except from the scratching of a living from olives, almonds and oranges. We have heard discussion on the relative amounts of water required to sustain a town, and a golf course, but does anybody have any idea of how much the local economy has benefitted from having these so called 'green eye sores' around them.
I believe that the majority of people visiting the southern Iberian peninsula in winter are indeed golfers, with a spending capacity probably far greater than the average family holiday spend, and it is they who are significantly extending the holiday season, and bringing increased prosperity. Has anybody thought of visiting Blackpool, Morecombe etc. at this time of year. Ghost towns.
And who has yet come up with reliable information, rather than heresay, that shows that the water table is decreasing,and that it is due to golf course irrigation. If the water table is suffering then it is more likely to be multi factorial, such as increased numbers of visitors, climate change, rather than being purely the fault of one specific minority area.
It is so easy to apportian blame, without recourse to the facts.
I wonder is there fox hunting in Portugal...........
FORE
In many countries in Europe farmers are trying to convert their land to golf courses because they cannot make a living from their land by agricultural means.
In Portugal the land that is being converted has little other commercial benefit, except from the scratching of a living from olives, almonds and oranges. We have heard discussion on the relative amounts of water required to sustain a town, and a golf course, but does anybody have any idea of how much the local economy has benefitted from having these so called 'green eye sores' around them.
I believe that the majority of people visiting the southern Iberian peninsula in winter are indeed golfers, with a spending capacity probably far greater than the average family holiday spend, and it is they who are significantly extending the holiday season, and bringing increased prosperity. Has anybody thought of visiting Blackpool, Morecombe etc. at this time of year. Ghost towns.
And who has yet come up with reliable information, rather than heresay, that shows that the water table is decreasing,and that it is due to golf course irrigation. If the water table is suffering then it is more likely to be multi factorial, such as increased numbers of visitors, climate change, rather than being purely the fault of one specific minority area.
It is so easy to apportian blame, without recourse to the facts.
I wonder is there fox hunting in Portugal...........
FORE
-
Ellie
Real/plastic
Oh gawd!
am I touching raw spots now with Tim and Hi handicap--daring to challenge the hallowed grounds and their existence
blimey -think your blinding me with science all this talk of litres per person & what have you
Ill "give ground" a little and say that golf courses can provide some haven for wildlife-no not the ones that"swing" --the feathered sort
But do take the question of water supply seriously--Algarve doesnt get that amount of rain that you can be blase about it---I think --I hope --that I have Martin on side here--he seems to know what he is speaking of.
Hi- Handicap--youve really frightened me---Im now getting this nightmarish vision of all southern Iberia turning into one giant golf course--now "that" could well send me to the South Pole--and I hate snow
Do any of you have anything to say about Guests(and mine) concern on this "overbuilding" or is it all "balls and greens" youre interested in
am I touching raw spots now with Tim and Hi handicap--daring to challenge the hallowed grounds and their existence
blimey -think your blinding me with science all this talk of litres per person & what have you
Ill "give ground" a little and say that golf courses can provide some haven for wildlife-no not the ones that"swing" --the feathered sort
But do take the question of water supply seriously--Algarve doesnt get that amount of rain that you can be blase about it---I think --I hope --that I have Martin on side here--he seems to know what he is speaking of.
Hi- Handicap--youve really frightened me---Im now getting this nightmarish vision of all southern Iberia turning into one giant golf course--now "that" could well send me to the South Pole--and I hate snow
Do any of you have anything to say about Guests(and mine) concern on this "overbuilding"
or is it all "balls and greens" youre interested in Ellie,
They keep all that water pumping away to keep golf courses green--why wasnt it used to put the fires out or am I being totally naive here--probably--I am
I am afraid those huge water dumping airplanes need a big large expansive reservoir to fill them up, none of which you would find on any golf course down there.
Just think though the golf courses could act as fire breaks....
They keep all that water pumping away to keep golf courses green--why wasnt it used to put the fires out or am I being totally naive here--probably--I am
I am afraid those huge water dumping airplanes need a big large expansive reservoir to fill them up, none of which you would find on any golf course down there.
Just think though the golf courses could act as fire breaks....
Last edited by Tiny Tim on Sun Nov 02, 2003 11:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Ellie,
Do any of you have anything to say about Guests(and mine) concern on this "overbuilding" or is it all "balls and greens" youre interested in
What is your definition of "overbuilding"? I am really interested in a balanced look at this perception of golf being, from certain quarters, a blotch on the environment with no positive aspects and only a drain on the environment.
Tiny
Do any of you have anything to say about Guests(and mine) concern on this "overbuilding" or is it all "balls and greens" youre interested in
What is your definition of "overbuilding"? I am really interested in a balanced look at this perception of golf being, from certain quarters, a blotch on the environment with no positive aspects and only a drain on the environment.
Tiny
Last edited by Tiny Tim on Sun Nov 02, 2003 11:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
Ellie
suggestion?
I didnt think that one through very well Tim did I?
Couldnt they "dig up" just one of those courses and turn it into a ---reservoir 
Im not totally against golf courses--course Im not---mm-but do we really need any more? Surely there has to be a limit?
I wish there was just the same space for our children to play in.
Do you think theres too much building going on--why cant they renervate older properties?
Or we just here to talk about golf?
Couldnt they "dig up" just one of those courses and turn it into a ---reservoir
Im not totally against golf courses--course Im not---mm-but do we really need any more? Surely there has to be a limit?
I wish there was just the same space for our children to play in.
Do you think theres too much building going on--why cant they renervate older properties?
Or we just here to talk about golf?
-
Ellie
too much building?
in using word "overbuilding" I was referring to the original message --the website there--with the intention of building another 1000 villas near Silves.
I think Martin will have concerns --as he lives near there.I think I mean "loss of countryside"--thats what concerns me Tim.
I think Martin will have concerns --as he lives near there.I think I mean "loss of countryside"--thats what concerns me Tim.
-
Hi handicap
Ellie, of course golf clubs are havens for feathered wildlife. We regularly have birdies, the occasional eagle, and even the albatross is a possibility.
I dont thinkyou should worry to much about the prospect of wall to wall golf courses - there's only so many that are sustainable.
Youre quite right about the building though - there are a huge number of places lying derelict. And theres nothing wrong with them that money couldnt put right
I dont thinkyou should worry to much about the prospect of wall to wall golf courses - there's only so many that are sustainable.
Youre quite right about the building though - there are a huge number of places lying derelict. And theres nothing wrong with them that money couldnt put right