bloodsports

[petermeachem]

Piglet, of course you are right. Start a thread, might be particular relevance to ex-pats.

[eco/spider]

If the forelock tuggers stopped running round for the snotty classes then that would help us get rid of them, all they achieve is to perpetuate a system that belongs in the nineteenth centuary, they should be dragged by their jodphours into the twenty first by a load of angry foxes. But rest assured, their bloody days are numbered and soon we will be able to tell our children about the horrors on horesback who chased deer foxes hare and anything else that had fur, to death, and had a jolly good drink at the end of it. Tally Ho!! will be a yell no longer heard. Then maybe we can start on other murdering habits to the areas of the wildlife kingdom.

[Graham]

Peter - I don't quite see where you got the 'Tony Blair won't let us have two houses' thing from but lets look, just for the sake of debate, at the anti fox hunting argument.

1. It is cruel to animals.
2. Nope, that's it. That's the argument.

Now if this is the case, why start with foxhunting, which has used enourmous amounts of Parliamentary time to save a relatively small amount of suffering.

I personally try to only eat meat that has had a reasonable standard of life. This is impossible - Danish bacon comes from pigs usually kept in inhumane conditions, whereas British pigs have a better life - BUT, if the carcass is imported into Britain before being sliced/smoked etc it can be labelled British.

I would much rather not eat Kosher or Hallal meat, as I find the method of killing distasteful, but whilst it is regulated that non-kosher meat cannot be labelled as kosher, it is quite alright to offer kosher meat with no labelling so people that think it has been slaughtered humanely.

I do not wish to eat any meat from intensive farming, but aside from only eating vegetarian food in restaurants this is not possible - restaurants should have to state their sources.

I think that if they could have the choice many people would agree with the above, and thus if legislative time was used to solve these issues then demand and supply would create far less intensive farming and far more moral methods. This would save millions, rather than tens of thousands of animals from unneccesary cruelty but it does not seem to have the priority that it deserves.

There are many, many things that are as cruel as foxhunting even excluding the food production methods so commonly used, but they are not even being discussed, let alone legislated against.

The only reason I can see that fox hunting has been such a big issue is because of the desire to inflict damage on one sector of society percieved as better off than the rest - it is for this reason that I think the whole thing is a disgrace when there is so much more that could have been done if only people wern't so blinkered in their attitudes. Fix the bigger issues before tinkering with the smaller ones.

[Guest]

Excellent post Graham

[petermeachem]

Good post Graham. I completely misread someone else's post. I don't agree with your last para, but it would be dull if everyone agreed.
I think I shall just ignore people who don't put their names, unless it's obvious by style who it is.

[Graham]

Thank you Peter - I think we disagree on almost everything, and long may that continue, but maybe debates such as this will persuade some people to at least look at the options and not believe all they hear and read.

Graham

PS I did think you mis-read about two houses but wasn't 100% sure - glad you cleared that up

[mac]

Graham - excellent post. I entirely agree. Most people don't seem to be aware that our right to ban the live export of horses is going to end soon. That hasn't even come up for debate in the commons. Most people seem to be so apathetic about causes like this when there is very real cruelty and torture done to these poor animals. I totally agree about buying from non intensive farming practices but of course, that adds about 40p on the price of a steak or whatever and people just want the cheapest.

There are loads of far more important issues that should matter to us these days and the money being wasted on debating about fox hunting defies belief!

[Lesley Jean]

Well done Piglet, think you have done a good job with this one! keeping everyone on their toes I think. Some good replies and some silly ones but a good debate.

[Elle]

Think you might enjoy this one Lesley (btw hope MM is doing okay..give him a pat for me )
On our return to England in the mid 90s...we had to find a 'roof' for our heads..so we 'went into service' & lived in a tied cottage for a while,working for bloke in large Manor house. I had job as housekeeper..in charge of all domestics...
to my horror..I found pics everywhere of 'the hunt'..I asked the chap about it..and he waxed lyrical how wonderful it was ..how enjoyed it..great sport etc etc..he even walked around indoors in all the gear..swinging his crop..
but I started to notice..that every time he came back from his'sport' ,,he was either limping or complaining about his shoulder or something..
when I asked the '60 year old MAID!!! about it...she replied in broad country tones
"Ooh arrrhh..thats cos hes always falling off his bloody horse!!!!
Poetic justice I'd say

[Lesley Jean]

Definitley Ellie, a little story for you, when I was 18 - 19 I went to work with horses as I had always wanted to, in Sussex for a quite well to do family, they hunted, which I had to join in aswell, being head groom you had to do these things, and I wasn't quite so anti then as I got paid to do my job! The hunt we rode with had Gerald Harper the actor riding with them whilst he was learning to ride for his series on tv, Adam Adamant, don't know if you remember it? Anyway, the horse I was riding was built like a battleship, and once during the hunt, Gerald couldn't stop his horse so he aimed it at my horses rear end, which was the size of a barn, to stop! it worked, and I spent the rest of the day talking to him.
MM is doing very well , last event of the year coming up on Friday, has been in the top 5 for the past five or six events !!

[digger]

Thanks for your comments Digger, could you spare a bit of you drinking time and explain the way of setting up a pole on the topic please

ooops sorry been a bit busy and someones beat me to it
and the commies are in the lead...

[Guest]

ok…………a compromise……..

digger

[Guest]

I've just come back from holiday and think I have found the solution to the vacuum that will be created by the ban on foxhunting.
Get Tony's mate in Spain to bring over bull fighting. Would be a great way to open up the new Wembley stadium.

Saw it in Madrid and it was magic. Eight beautiful proud beasts slowly bled and speared to close to death before the guys with the swords dispatched them. One matador wasn't too good and it took him a few goes to finish it off. One of the bulls got its own back however by goring one of the horses. What a sight. Isn't it great to be part of the EU and know that others share the same concerns about cruelty to animals.

P.S. And the sherry is lovely too!

[a girlie]

Why did you go to watch the bullfight guest? Was it your first time and out of curiosity?
Mindless cruelty isnt it? A 'brave' man finally putting an already weakened dumb beast out of its agony?
They also throw goats-with legs tied-from church rooftops in Spain. Why?
Some years ago I watched a programme on tv about rural Portugal,where a local sport consisted of burying chickens in the ground up to their necks and locals played some game at trying to knock the creatures heads off. Why?
are we still in the dark ages? is this topic in the right place? who knows anymore