EURO ????

Bruxinha · Post by **Bruxinha** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 2:04 pm

Hi again Homme Poco,

I am not an accountant but this is what I believe to be correct.

The CGT is different for residents and non-residents. An example is as follows:

If you are resident and bought a house for 100.000 euros and then sold it for 200.000 euros, the profit would be 100.000 euros. You would then pay CGT of 25% on 50% of this profit ie 50% of 100.000 euros is 50.000 euros and you would pay 25% CGT on this, which equals 12.500 euros.

If you are non-resident and made the above profit, you would pay 25% CGT on 100% of the profit ie 25.000 euros.

You can off set things like home improvements etc against this "gross profit" and then it would become a "net profit" and would reduce your CGT BUT you must be able to produce proper FACTURAS (invoices) to prove this and not simple recibos (receipts). Difficult I know in Portugal, where trying to get a factura for anything is like trying to get "blood out of a stone"!! I've recently posted a copy of an email sent to me by a Portuguese friend about this on the Portuguese forum and would urge everyone who reads Portuguese to read it and try to help raise the wealth and standard of living for everyone here, not just the few. Otherwise I fear things will not ever substantially improve here.

Although you paid in sterling for your house, it must have been transferred into escudos ie on your deed signed at the notary it would say the value in escudos not sterling to calculate Portugueses taxes etc.

Hope this helps. Good luck with waiting for the Câmara!!!!!!! Keep taking the pills!!!!!

digger · Post by **digger** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 3:45 pm

Bruxinha wrote: If you are resident and bought a house for 100.000 euros and then sold it for 200.000 euros, the profit would be 100.000 euros. You would then pay CGT of 25% on 50% of this profit ie 50% of 100.000 euros is 50.000 euros and you would pay 25% CGT on this, which equals 12.500 euros.

ola Bruxinha
I’ve been making some enquiries recently re: CGT, and looking at your example of the resident who makes 100.000 profit and pays tax on half of that (50.000) …. according to my figures, he would pay 38 percent …… 19.000 euros !! (unless I’m missing something)

Bruxinha · Post by **Bruxinha** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 6:25 pm

Good Afternoon Digger,

Yes, you may well be right, and I am missing something, as I said I am no accountant or expert on this and my info is based on what I was told at the beginning of this year when some friends of mine sold a house here. Things are of course always changing! So it is worse than I thought ie 38% instead of 25%! What I do believe is a few people could be in for a shock when they sell properties, which have been severely underdeclared either with or without their consent!

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 11:13 pm

And down it goes again..........The good thing is that whatever we buy here..or build, is getting cheaper by the day.The bad thing.is for the UK bods looking to sell up and go back to Blighty..........BUT,,..What if..Just What if...........Europe is calling to go back to their own currencies.......too far fetched.....is it ???..........Europe is fuming at the success of Uk and the failure of the Euro......the Constitition is dead ..dead.......where does Europe go..and for Portugal who never even understood the good times were here......Personally I think Portugal is in for a big shock...sadly they have never got smart and learnt anything...as Ireland and other members have.....beaurocracy and corruption is the everyday norm...to set up a company of any size is ..impossible .........I say these things as one that for ten years has tried so hard to pump in a lot of money ..(Million Plus)......to manufature and employ...but eventually as one that has given up and retired..Lovely food and weather..........Sorry Portugal.....Untill you can rid yourself of Bearocracy and corruption.......you will only go down faster and deeper.........

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sun Jun 19, 2005 11:17 pm

Now that it's almost only Brits that come here........(80...20 ) does that not mean that it will be even more cheap to come here as the Euro weakens..or collapses.....so am I right in saying that the Algarve and the finances of Portugal to a large extend ..depend on just what is happening in UK.......??

digger · Post by **digger** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 12:40 pm

Bruxinha wrote:Good Afternoon Digger,

Yes, you may well be right, and I am missing something, as I said I am no accountant or expert on this and my info is based on what I was told at the beginning of this year when some friends of mine sold a house here. Things are of course always changing! So it is worse than I thought ie 38% instead of 25%! What I do believe is a few people could be in for a shock when they sell properties, which have been severely underdeclared either with or without their consent!

hey bruxi
I too am no accountant. I picked up some info on CGT at my local Finances the other day …… but may have lost something in translation.
anyway I’m in touch with pt’s top man on the subject

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 1:54 pm

Hey Digger,

"Lost in Translation at the local Finanças" or simply "Lost in Finanças"...could be a title for a book or a film couldn't it? Certainly a visit to Finanças tests my Portuguese skills, or lack of them, to the limit and often the info you get depends on whose on duty on the balcão that day. I suppose I am a pesty estrangeira, who asks far too many questions for her own good! Anyway interested to hear if you get any more up to date info from your man in the know.

I am afraid I have to agree with what the guest wrote about bureaucracy and corruption. People are very short-sighted and can't see the wood for the trees sometimes. It all comes down to educating people I suppose. I spoke with a Portuguese builder once, as diplomatically as I could, about the way he and others work here and when I questioned the morality of what he was doing, he simply replied "it works better like that"...better for him and a few others maybe, but certainly not for the country as a whole. Then again, I've always been a idealist........Bruxy

digger · Post by **digger** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 3:04 pm

Anonymous wrote: "Lost in Translation at the local Finanças" or simply "Lost in Finanças"...could be a title for a book or a film couldn't it? ...........................

you may well laugh!…. you’re one of ‘them’. I bet you even know the difference between the one shoulder shrug and the two shoulder shrug

Bruxinha · Post by **Bruxinha** » Mon Jun 20, 2005 7:43 pm

Hmmm...I am afraid I do Digger. I usually get the two shoulder variety, plus severe rolling of the eyes...still, I haven't been thrown out or banned from any department YET!!

By the way I see you are from Cascais. I spent many weeks living in Cobre a few years ago. Guincho beach was a favourite haunt of mine, as well as Praia Grande. I think they can give the Algarve beaches a run for their money. I miss my regular train journeys from Cais do Sodré to Cascais at sunset...spectacular!

Gambrinus · Post by **Gambrinus** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 8:20 am

Bruxinha wrote: I think they can give the Algarve beaches a run for their money.

Now you are being cynical...

I guess you can add the recent events on the beaches to that ever-growing list of things that are out of place. Instead of integrating foreigners into society and recognizing them as an opportunity for economic and cultural growth, treating foreigners like a threat to society has become common practice in most of Europe. On top of that, the immigration laws in some countries facilitate abuse to an extent, that people do preceive foreigners as a threat to their livelyhood.

What I dont get though, is how they expect to have a single currency, constitution, etc when most of the european countries don't even speak a common language (english skills in Germany and France are dismal on average) and you have probably noticed that some public services (emphasis on "service") in Portugal are not exactly cut out to accomodate foreigners either.

dodger · Post by **dodger** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:33 am

English language skills are dismal in Germany/France?What about foreign language skills in Great Britain?!Virtually non existant!!!!
If us in GB go into a cafe/shop abroad and they don't speak english we think its the end of the world!

Ellie · Post by **Ellie** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 11:52 am

Well said Dodger and I think its only polite to at least try the language of the country you are holidaying in......
But even so..I speak reasonable French yet Ive often come up against Frenchies that say "Uh?" in quite a rude manner ...and that can be very off putting!......
I'v never had that from a Portuguese when I use the language..if I get it a bit wrong ..they correct me but with a smile

I try out my German(very limited) when in CVO with German friends..and they too are very helpful & patient with me..
I've been helping a German friend with his English on recent visits....although it is excellent there are certain words he has difficulty with.. pronunciation and their meaning....
when Im sitting in Colombos of an evening..and with these friends..I find Im picking up more & more..
Its fun

dodger · Post by **dodger** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:08 pm

My girlfriend and I were in Silves last summer when we stopped off at a cafe for lunch,the staff spoke no english and us no portuguese........hence the order came totally incorrect!
We at first thought how bloody stupid,I mean Silves gets a fair amount of tourists so why not speak english?then we stop and thought'hey we are in Portugal,no wonder they happen to speak portuguese!'
Bloody narrow minded of us or what?

dodger · Post by **dodger** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:10 pm

Mind you,we ate everything that was on the plate!!

digger · Post by **digger** » Tue Jun 21, 2005 1:42 pm

Bruxinha wrote: By the way I see you are from Cascais. I spent many weeks living in Cobre a few years ago. Guincho beach was a favourite haunt of mine, as well as Praia Grande. I think they can give the Algarve beaches a run for their money. I miss my regular train journeys from Cais do Sodré to Cascais at sunset...spectacular!

yes, Guincho ..... and up that way…. is nice. I’ve probably seen most of Portugal’s coastline and it is spectacular, but IMO the Algarve beaches come top ….. and the water is warmer down there too.